{"items": [{"author": "Jess", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799902696462", "anchor": "fb-799902696462", "service": "fb", "text": "Are you sure that NJ and MS's laws are typical in allowing for an exception? (Not that it really matters. Who is going to risk going to jail by banking on some patrolman's estimate of the \"usual\" markup?)", "timestamp": "1468695887"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799902696462&reply_comment_id=799905356132", "anchor": "fb-799902696462_799905356132", "service": "fb", "text": "→ Here's a list of price gouging laws: https://knowledgeproblem.com/.../list-of-price-gouging-laws/

Going through the ones that provide a link:

* AL: allows \"reasonable costs\" http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/alcode/8/31/8-31-4

* NC: \"In determining whether a price is unreasonably excessive, it shall be considered whether [among other things] the price charged by the seller is attributable to additional costs imposed by the seller's supplier or other costs of providing the good or service during the triggering event\" http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/.../Chapter_75/GS_75-38.html

* PA \"shall not apply if the increase in price is due to a disparity that is substantially attributable to additional costs that arose within the chain of distribution in connection with the sale of consumer goods or services, including replacement costs, credit card costs, taxes and transportation costs.\" http://www.legis.state.pa.us/.../LI/US/HTM/2006/0/0133..HTM

* TX \"demanding an exorbitant or excessive price\", no details on how to tell http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/.../htm/BC.17.htm...

* UT: \"A person may charge an excessive price if that person's cost of obtaining the good or providing the service exceeds the average cost to the person of obtaining the good or providing the service in the 30-day period immediately preceding the day on which the state of emergency is declared; and (b) the price charged for the good or service does not exceed the sum of: (i) 10% above the total cost to that person of obtaining the good or providing the service; and (ii) the person's customary markup.\" http://le.utah.gov/xcode/Title13/Chapter41/13-41-S201.html

So all but TX explicitly allow an exception for increased costs, and TX may allow it. Only UT and NJ, though, explicitly allow charging your markup (+10pp in both cases) on the increased costs.", "timestamp": "1468696791"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799902696462&reply_comment_id=799906004832", "anchor": "fb-799902696462_799906004832", "service": "fb", "text": "→ So all of these would allow running your generators and charging the markup necessary to do that, but only NJ and UT would allow the profit that makes it worth it to truck in supplies from out of state.", "timestamp": "1468697063"}, {"author": "Jess", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799902696462&reply_comment_id=799907950932", "anchor": "fb-799902696462_799907950932", "service": "fb", "text": "→ Nice research. Thanks Jeff!", "timestamp": "1468698134"}, {"author": "David Chudzicki", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799907641552", "anchor": "fb-799907641552", "service": "fb", "text": "It's not clear to me that \"the markup customarily applied\" (plus 10%) justifies the risk of filling extra tankers and driving them to NJ. So you've shown the generator argument doesn't work, but i think the other one you quoted may still be right.", "timestamp": "1468697835"}, {"author": "Howie", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=799910870082", "anchor": "fb-799910870082", "service": "fb", "text": "Agree with David above. Also, I'd guess that the laws add a bunch of extra risk and compliance costs because companies are probably uncertain about how \"other costs of providing the good or service during the state of emergency\" will actually be interpreted. These events are rare enough that there's probably not a ton of case law and it seems like there's room for a lot of ambiguity (Random example: are you sure courts will count the time you put into finding new suppliers during an emergency count as a cost? Do you have to set up an accounting system to track these costs? Can you count it as a cost if the opportunity cost of your time went up because you'd rather leave town and stay with relatives than keep your shop open?). Small businesses also might not have easy access to legal advice on how to handle this.", "timestamp": "1468699797"}, {"author": "Jacob", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=800014153102", "anchor": "fb-800014153102", "service": "fb", "text": "Also, the distinction doesn't seem to mean much. It costs a big chunk to bring in the extra gas, and gas stations don't keep much reserves. If you can't jack up the price to get short-term cash, you won't be able to get the larger supply.", "timestamp": "1468768915"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=800014153102&reply_comment_id=800016648102", "anchor": "fb-800014153102_800016648102", "service": "fb", "text": "→ Several of the laws explicitly state that you can use replacement cost accounting, but for most it's unclear if this is allowed.", "timestamp": "1468770100"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=895194336252", "anchor": "fb-895194336252", "service": "fb", "text": "This is coming up again with places running out of gas with the eclipse. Oregon's rules seem to be: https://www.doj.state.or.us/.../sales.../price-gouging/", "timestamp": "1503232641"}, {"author": "Michael", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/799902142572?comment_id=895194336252&reply_comment_id=895212390072", "anchor": "fb-895194336252_895212390072", "service": "fb", "text": "→ The governor has not yet declared that \u201can abnormal disruption of the market\u201d has occurred. A station owner might be willing to order a load of gasoline at somewhat more than his usual cost, on spec that he'll be able to more than recoup the cost if supplies get tight and he can raise prices a lot. If supplies don't get tight, he's lost money because he's bought ahead at a high price what he could get later at the usual price. It's a reasonable decision on his part to take the risk. If the governor does declare, then he's only allowed to cover his cost, which means his upside is very limited, while his downside is unchanged, which means that he never would have ordered the extra supply. So if the station owner thinks that the governor will declare, and apply this law, he's just going to stand pat, and when he runs out of gas, he'll take a little vacation, and fuck the people who need the gas, because the state law is not going to let him do business in the normal manner. It's a good example of where government intervention can be worse than letting the free market operate.", "timestamp": "1503241412"}]}