{"items": [{"author": "Marie-Mich\u00e8le", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844695276772", "anchor": "fb-844695276772", "service": "fb", "text": "Although we might have confusion if the dances using Jets&Rubies go for the obvious Black and Red", "timestamp": "1485956974"}, {"author": "Emily", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844706579122", "anchor": "fb-844706579122", "service": "fb", "text": "I think, actually, that having a two color option is a good idea, despite the fact that I don't think I'd wear one. I think it's a good idea for new dancers, especially if two new dancers are partnered together, because that way other people know, if that person looks lost, very quickly how to better assist.
I have been at dances that use the neckties, and I don't like them because they're much harder to put on and take off quickly and easily.", "timestamp": "1485961114"}, {"author": "Perry", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844707023232", "anchor": "fb-844707023232", "service": "fb", "text": "I still oppose markers because that will prevent dancers from learning how to dance positionally. I guess it is a good visual aid, but as long as the markers themselves aren't gender-enforcing it is not as bad. Ties to represent the male role emphasizes that it is the gents role, so it's still gendered. For the ladies role some sort of headpiece has been used. Let's at least not use visual aids that are heavily tied to gender.", "timestamp": "1485961283"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844707023232&reply_comment_id=844747776562", "anchor": "fb-844707023232_844747776562", "service": "fb", "text": "→ \"that will prevent dancers from learning how to dance positionally\"
I'm expecting that most dancers in the hall will not be wearing a marker, which means you have to dance positionally.
\"Let's at least not use visual aids that are heavily tied to gender.\"
I'm not advocating that.", "timestamp": "1485973229"}, {"author": "Perry", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844707023232&reply_comment_id=844749233642", "anchor": "fb-844707023232_844749233642", "service": "fb", "text": "→ Wouldn't this work a lot better if everyone was wearing markers? What would be the benefit of some people wearing markers and some others not?", "timestamp": "1485973494"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844707023232&reply_comment_id=844752916262", "anchor": "fb-844707023232_844752916262", "service": "fb", "text": "→ @Perry: Most people don't want to wear markers, and positional dancing works fine, so I don't think we should push people to wear markers who don't want them (which includes me).
But as long as you have a different marker for each role, I'm fine having them available as an option. Someone who wants to signal their chosen role (because they're new, or they find it easier) can do so.", "timestamp": "1485974048"}, {"author": "Linda", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844716948342", "anchor": "fb-844716948342", "service": "fb", "text": "I know of al least two events that used markers for the two positions. A birthday party in May 2016 chose hearts and diamonds, and the celebrants bought playing cards, and glued a diamond on one side, a heart on the other, and light lanyard glued in between. It was very easy to turn the lanyard around to show the other position. The other group, now not dancing, but active for two years, chose blue and red wrist bands, as well as these terms for the position. These bands were very easy to move/remove. This was in Mexico. Azul was used on the left wrist; rojo on the right wrist. The dancers were mostly of one gender, so the wristbands were very helpful in reminding dancers of the position they should take after a swing.", "timestamp": "1485964392"}, {"author": "BDan", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844716948342&reply_comment_id=844767342352", "anchor": "fb-844716948342_844767342352", "service": "fb", "text": "→ Ooh, I like the left wrist / right wrist distinction in addition to the colors.", "timestamp": "1485978646"}, {"author": "Rachel", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844805655572", "anchor": "fb-844805655572", "service": "fb", "text": "I personally dislike any type of required marker (including name tags) and have resisted wearing them literally since I was ten. I don't like being physically identified by my body, or giving people any more reasons to look at things not my face. They also often get in the way, fall off, or get snagged.", "timestamp": "1485989783"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=844805655572&reply_comment_id=844845610502", "anchor": "fb-844805655572_844845610502", "service": "fb", "text": "→ The markers being \"wear them if they're useful to you\" is key to my being OK with them", "timestamp": "1486001679"}, {"author": "Josh", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=845092974782", "anchor": "fb-845092974782", "service": "fb", "text": "I feel like one of the advantages of markers (like armbands) is that you can change roles over the course of the evening, by sticking your armband in your pocket (or bag, or bra, or whatever) when you want to dance barearm and putting it on when you want to dance armband.
I imagine that this would also work with two armbands, so that seems fine; but I was surprised that you mentioned \"get in the way if you want to switch roles from dance to dance\" as a drawback. (As oppose to trousers and skirts, say, which are traditional markers and very very distinguishable, but much harder to switch between than armbands, at least if you don't want to show people your underwear. And also because people who like dancing in skirts might want to dance Lark sometimes, and vice versa, of course.)", "timestamp": "1486075336"}, {"author": "Jeff Kaufman", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=845092974782&reply_comment_id=845105734212", "anchor": "fb-845092974782_845105734212", "service": "fb", "text": "→ The alternative to markers that I'm considering isn't \"everyone dances the role that matches their gender presentation\" but \"everyone dances positionally\".", "timestamp": "1486079019"}, {"author": "Sarah", "source_link": "https://www.facebook.com/jefftk/posts/844584723322?comment_id=845117700232", "anchor": "fb-845117700232", "service": "fb", "text": "I feel like there's a disconnect between people who are trying to learn/dance at a lower level and people for whom the dances come easily. I haven't done it in years, but I did a bunch of geeky modern western square dancing (MIT) -- at teaching levels, markers were an absolute necessity; there's too much else to learn. (At the time I was doing it markers == gender presentation; I'm guessing/hoping that's less so now, at least in the circles that don't do the traditional-gender-role costuming thing, eeurgh.) Granted, there were also often several squares of high-level dancers in the back, dancing not only positionally but with up to half the dancers missing, so anyone who wanted to dance arky had plenty of opportunities.
(Heck, in the trad-gender-costuming modern western squares application, people don't change partners and couples come in complementary outfits, so you can not only tell role at an instant, but initial position in the set, which I expect helps with tricky calls.)", "timestamp": "1486083210"}]}